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	<title>Comments on: The hypocrisy of Europe’s railways: some observations after a journey from Brussels to Germany</title>
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	<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/</link>
	<description>At the intersection of the EU, UK politics and tech</description>
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		<title>By: JM Simon&#39;s Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The Ryanair Flying Circus</title>
		<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/comment-page-1/#comment-125653</link>
		<dc:creator>JM Simon&#39;s Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The Ryanair Flying Circus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 Jan 2010 15:39:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonworth.eu/?p=3062#comment-125653</guid>
		<description>[...] can be booked any the Belgian station (booking the trip online is impossible) and considering the reliability of the train system in Europe lately a trip with more than 2 changes involving 3 countries is something that you just don&#8217;t want [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] can be booked any the Belgian station (booking the trip online is impossible) and considering the reliability of the train system in Europe lately a trip with more than 2 changes involving 3 countries is something that you just don&#8217;t want [...]</p>
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		<title>By: french derek</title>
		<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/comment-page-1/#comment-125631</link>
		<dc:creator>french derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 14:01:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonworth.eu/?p=3062#comment-125631</guid>
		<description>In terms of information on rail journeys I have found SBB do a superb job. Unfortunately, it&#039;s not always possible to  book those journeys through their site. I had real problems when I tried to book via TGV, etc from our home station (in SW France) to Berlin: SBB couldn&#039;t do it, the SNCF site couldn&#039;t manage it, and even a SNCF station  booking clerk at first denied it was possible.

I also have found seat61.com (the man in seat 61) to be informative when helping myself and others to plan long distance journeys in and beyond Europe.

SNCF and DB have a lot to learn, never mind Railteam.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In terms of information on rail journeys I have found SBB do a superb job. Unfortunately, it&#8217;s not always possible to  book those journeys through their site. I had real problems when I tried to book via TGV, etc from our home station (in SW France) to Berlin: SBB couldn&#8217;t do it, the SNCF site couldn&#8217;t manage it, and even a SNCF station  booking clerk at first denied it was possible.</p>
<p>I also have found seat61.com (the man in seat 61) to be informative when helping myself and others to plan long distance journeys in and beyond Europe.</p>
<p>SNCF and DB have a lot to learn, never mind Railteam.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/comment-page-1/#comment-125629</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 10:28:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonworth.eu/?p=3062#comment-125629</guid>
		<description>Jon, given how overworked German locomotive drivers are (see this report on ZDF: http://frontal21.zdf.de/ZDFde/inhalt/26/0,1872,8014106,00.html), it&#039;s probably good if you don&#039;t take their trains for the time being. Deutsche Bahn is currently going from one scandal to the next, mostly due to profit-driven decisions that affect passenger comfort and/or safety - not to speak of their own staff.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jon, given how overworked German locomotive drivers are (see this report on ZDF: <a href="http://frontal21.zdf.de/ZDFde/inhalt/26/0,1872,8014106,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://frontal21.zdf.de/ZDFde/inhalt/26/0,1872,8014106,00.html</a>), it&#8217;s probably good if you don&#8217;t take their trains for the time being. Deutsche Bahn is currently going from one scandal to the next, mostly due to profit-driven decisions that affect passenger comfort and/or safety &#8211; not to speak of their own staff.</p>
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		<title>By: James Burnside</title>
		<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/comment-page-1/#comment-125627</link>
		<dc:creator>James Burnside</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 08:42:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonworth.eu/?p=3062#comment-125627</guid>
		<description>Too right, Railteam has achieved nothing; although I suspect that&#039;s mostly because the individual companies within it (led by DB and SNCF) do not want Railteam to supplant their own identities in the slightest, so haven&#039;t made any efforts to make it useful. If you look at their site, their only commitment (&#039;hop on the next train&#039;) is to assist with alternative connections between railteam services if one is delayed to the extent that you miss a connection to another railteam service.

As for a single booking system, they &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.tnooz.com/2009/12/01/news/railteam-says-it-has-not-spoken-to-a-travel-technology-firm-in-two-years/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;quietly dropped that last year&lt;/a&gt; on grounds of cost and complexity, although it was one of their initial promises. Such a system is on the Commission&#039;s radar, and would presumably cover all international services not just high-speed ones. But it&#039;s not clear to what extent they can act in this field, since they&#039;re not likely to set it up themselves. Airline CRSs already existed, and the Commission acted to ensure each one treated all services fairly, not favouring those of its owner airlines. Here there is very little by way of competition between services, so little by way of a competiton issue in respect of booking systems. So it may require a lot of carrots.

Of course it&#039;s worth remembering that computerisation has made the rail ticket system much worse for international journeys. Not so long ago, one could purchase a rail ticket, and seat reservations, for pretty much any journey in western Europe from many stations or travel agents. Now, where that is still possible, one can generally only get the more expensive fares, with the cheap ones restricted to the system of the company concerned. And more often than not, it&#039;s not possible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Too right, Railteam has achieved nothing; although I suspect that&#8217;s mostly because the individual companies within it (led by DB and SNCF) do not want Railteam to supplant their own identities in the slightest, so haven&#8217;t made any efforts to make it useful. If you look at their site, their only commitment (&#8216;hop on the next train&#8217;) is to assist with alternative connections between railteam services if one is delayed to the extent that you miss a connection to another railteam service.</p>
<p>As for a single booking system, they <a href="http://www.tnooz.com/2009/12/01/news/railteam-says-it-has-not-spoken-to-a-travel-technology-firm-in-two-years/" rel="nofollow">quietly dropped that last year</a> on grounds of cost and complexity, although it was one of their initial promises. Such a system is on the Commission&#8217;s radar, and would presumably cover all international services not just high-speed ones. But it&#8217;s not clear to what extent they can act in this field, since they&#8217;re not likely to set it up themselves. Airline CRSs already existed, and the Commission acted to ensure each one treated all services fairly, not favouring those of its owner airlines. Here there is very little by way of competition between services, so little by way of a competiton issue in respect of booking systems. So it may require a lot of carrots.</p>
<p>Of course it&#8217;s worth remembering that computerisation has made the rail ticket system much worse for international journeys. Not so long ago, one could purchase a rail ticket, and seat reservations, for pretty much any journey in western Europe from many stations or travel agents. Now, where that is still possible, one can generally only get the more expensive fares, with the cheap ones restricted to the system of the company concerned. And more often than not, it&#8217;s not possible.</p>
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		<title>By: André Feldhof</title>
		<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/comment-page-1/#comment-125625</link>
		<dc:creator>André Feldhof</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 23:49:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonworth.eu/?p=3062#comment-125625</guid>
		<description>you should definitely apply ;). 

two add-ons to your article:

Firstly, your criticism of the terrible international performance of Deutsche Bahn and the SNCF is also reflected in this (German) piece by Deutsche Welle radio: http://bit.ly/7EwJwC (unfortunately, since Germany passed a law against online storage of audio and video material, it will expire tomorrow)  

Secondly, two journalists published a &quot;black book&quot; on Deutsche Bahn on Monday, claiming among others that the company employed cheap workers from Eastern Europe who were forced to work eleven hours a day, seven days a week for months. In some cases, they apparently only paid the workers 1,50 EUR per hour for their work. More info is here: http://bit.ly/4uZj93 (also in German).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>you should definitely apply <img src='http://www.jonworth.eu/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> . </p>
<p>two add-ons to your article:</p>
<p>Firstly, your criticism of the terrible international performance of Deutsche Bahn and the SNCF is also reflected in this (German) piece by Deutsche Welle radio: <a href="http://bit.ly/7EwJwC" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/7EwJwC</a> (unfortunately, since Germany passed a law against online storage of audio and video material, it will expire tomorrow)  </p>
<p>Secondly, two journalists published a &#8220;black book&#8221; on Deutsche Bahn on Monday, claiming among others that the company employed cheap workers from Eastern Europe who were forced to work eleven hours a day, seven days a week for months. In some cases, they apparently only paid the workers 1,50 EUR per hour for their work. More info is here: <a href="http://bit.ly/4uZj93" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/4uZj93</a> (also in German).</p>
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		<title>By: Jon</title>
		<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/comment-page-1/#comment-125621</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 18:20:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonworth.eu/?p=3062#comment-125621</guid>
		<description>Yes, Railteam is a sham as far as I can tell. Proper coordinated timetables and a unified booking system would have been really helpful, but those are not going to happen. The fact that it doesn&#039;t work when things go wrong makes it even more pointless.

On the FR-IT thing - the same has happened for the use of the LGV Est line towards Strasbourg and then on into Germany. SNCF and DB split things on those routes - SNCF runs the Stuttgart and München high speed services, while DB runs the ones to Frankfurt. Same looks like it might happen for Eurostar where DB might take a share in Eurostar rather than running competing services.

Quite frankly I don&#039;t know what SNCF is worrying about so much. They have plenty of know how - why don&#039;t they expand internationally, run in other markets, while accepting that nationally they are not going to be able to maintain 100% share?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, Railteam is a sham as far as I can tell. Proper coordinated timetables and a unified booking system would have been really helpful, but those are not going to happen. The fact that it doesn&#8217;t work when things go wrong makes it even more pointless.</p>
<p>On the FR-IT thing &#8211; the same has happened for the use of the LGV Est line towards Strasbourg and then on into Germany. SNCF and DB split things on those routes &#8211; SNCF runs the Stuttgart and München high speed services, while DB runs the ones to Frankfurt. Same looks like it might happen for Eurostar where DB might take a share in Eurostar rather than running competing services.</p>
<p>Quite frankly I don&#8217;t know what SNCF is worrying about so much. They have plenty of know how &#8211; why don&#8217;t they expand internationally, run in other markets, while accepting that nationally they are not going to be able to maintain 100% share?</p>
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		<title>By: french derek</title>
		<link>http://www.jonworth.eu/the-hypocrisy-of-europe%e2%80%99s-railways-some-observations-after-a-journey-from-brussels-to-germany/comment-page-1/#comment-125620</link>
		<dc:creator>french derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 18:00:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonworth.eu/?p=3062#comment-125620</guid>
		<description>Jon, is Railteam&quot; just someone&#039;s marketing idea? They were going to have a &quot;one-stop&quot; website for timetables, fares and bookings throughout Europe: but that seems to have disappeared even before it appeared?

I actually prefer taking the train to driving or to flying. But, as you note, the rail companies (and/or their governmental masters) do their best to make it as difficult as possible. SNCF, here in France, are said to be &quot;really worried&quot; about DB gaining competitive access to certain lines in France. But they&#039;ve ensured that the competition from Italy will be nil - by entering into a &quot;partnership&quot; deal. Exactly what the EU hoped wouldn&#039;t happen, Ho-ho.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jon, is Railteam&#8221; just someone&#8217;s marketing idea? They were going to have a &#8220;one-stop&#8221; website for timetables, fares and bookings throughout Europe: but that seems to have disappeared even before it appeared?</p>
<p>I actually prefer taking the train to driving or to flying. But, as you note, the rail companies (and/or their governmental masters) do their best to make it as difficult as possible. SNCF, here in France, are said to be &#8220;really worried&#8221; about DB gaining competitive access to certain lines in France. But they&#8217;ve ensured that the competition from Italy will be nil &#8211; by entering into a &#8220;partnership&#8221; deal. Exactly what the EU hoped wouldn&#8217;t happen, Ho-ho.</p>
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